Following Jesus in Nursing

Welcome to Following Jesus in Nursing, a podcast for nurses and students produced by InterVarsity's Nurses Christian Fellowship. I'm your host, Lara K> Kiser. And together, we'll be inspired by our guest stories, tackle big questions with experts in the field, and walk together in following Jesus at the intersection of faith and nursing.

One of the things that always helped me in those times was remembering that Jesus was with me always, like, for real, for real. And so I relied on him, talking to him all throughout the night. At one hospital, they called me the singing nurse because I'd be singing, and would help me.

So how do you know if your job is just in a taxing season or if it's truly toxic? Sometimes life and work are just hard, and we're called to persevere through strength in the Lord. Other times, though, we're free to leave and find a better fit. Later on in this episode, Skip shares how to tell from a mental health perspective when to stay and when to go. But first, we're gonna pick up the conversation as Skip shares stories about the ways that Jesus showed up during her time as a mental health nurse. Listen in.

So, yeah, just being available. And then also, I think in terms of sharing a story just with my colleagues, because we had to be there for each other. I mean, you really needed to have each other's back because you never knew when a patient might get upset. And just being willing to be helpful even with my colleagues whenever I could, however I could. Just even the relationship with the docs, you know, I just remember trying to maintain healthy relationships with the doctors.

Some were easier to communicate with than others, but I tried to have a good relationship with them as well. You know, it's just a whole team. You know, you got the docs and the nurses and the techs and the pharmacy. I mean, it's just like, woah. You're constantly having to think about how are you're gonna communicate with this team member on behalf of this patient.

I never thought about that before. How many people are involved in one patient's care and the communication between all those people is a really big part of good patient care.

Yeah. It's a lot. And, of course, the better the communication between the team, I feel like the better care that patient will get. And I would try to be a good teammate. I don't care how nice you try to be or whatever. Sometimes people just work your nerves, and you gotta figure it out. Because, oh, it can be hard to communicate with folks sometimes.

I would imagine that would be a hard day to come home from, like, getting your mentioning a patient that cussed you out, trying to keep yourself and the patient physically safe when they're having a psychotic break. You're dealing with interpersonal communication things with some who are easier and some who are harder to communicate with. You know, I'm just imagining what that day would feel like. I am wiped out just thinking about it. So how how would you let that go, and decompress? You know, how did you shake that off at the end of a shift?

Yeah. Well, you know, having colleagues that you can communicate well with was helpful. Like, one of the therapists, she and I became close friends, and I went and stood at her door. She said, you need to come in and close the door. I said, yes. I was upset about something I don't even remember. So that was helpful. Just having people that I could talk with even throughout the shift. And then, you know, when you finally get in your car and it's like, Woah, okay. And just kind of replaying the day, most of the time I was able, for the most part in all of my nursing career, to leave it at the job. You know, there might have been a few times when, you know, oh my goodness, did I remember to do that? Okay. What is gonna happen with this kid? Or just, you know, those kinds of things. But for the most part, once I got to my car, I was usually able to then shift things.

Well, what are some best practices for nurses around mental health? So both the piece and the patient care piece. Can you break down some of those best practices for us?

I would say for the nurse, first and foremost, is taking care of your own mental, emotional, spiritual, and physical health for those who have a faith, and it's important to them. Because, you know, this isn't true for all nurses, but I would say a lot of nurses are so other-focused that they tend to not focus enough on themselves. And I had to learn what that meant for me as well. And so taking care of yourself both personally and professionally, because the truth is if you're not taking good care of yourself before you get to the job, that's a strike right there. You need to come in there in the best shape possible, physically, spiritually, mentally.

And then, you know, once you're on the job you know. When I was a young nurse, I mean, I felt like, oh my goodness. I was just run over. took me a while, you know, because I was a pretty nice young kid coming into nursing. And, unfortunately, nursing has had a history of eating their young.

Yeah.

I had to learn the hard way how to take care of myself. And I finally did. So people couldn't just treat me any kind of way and you're not going to talk to me any kind of way, you know, cause I don't talk to you like that. Why are you talking to me like that? So learning what it means to take care of yourself professionally as well.

You know that Scripture in Ecclesiastes, I think, 3, it says there's a time to speak and there's a time to be silent. When is it time for you to speak and when is it time you just need to be quiet? You know? And so paying attention both personally and professionally and just some of the basic stuff, regular exercise. What does that look like for you?

Exercise for me may not be the same for you. You know, I can't be doing that CrossFit stuff. I'll hurt myself. So, you know, unless they have a senior version, you know, which I think they do.

Your eating. You know? Are you eating at least halfway decently healthy? You know? Sleep. That sleep thing is not overrated, man. We need to get a certain amount of that. And then just even what does a person do for relaxation? What do you do for play? One of my favorite is things to do to relax is to play a word game. I love word chums. It's one of my favorite things to do. I get all caught up in playing, you know? And so, you know, what is it that helps a person to relax? What is it that you do to play? One of my favorite things is to go out to eat. I like me some good food, good company, and good food. You know? So yeah. And then for the nurses' self-care, how are your relationships? Because I'm telling you, you know, check your relationships.

Are they healthy? Are you surrounding yourself? You know, we can't get away from everybody. That's hard, especially if they're in your family. But do you at least have a good number of people around you who are healthy, they're not just trying to take from you all the time, but they're actually wanting to give to you.

And then I would say for the patient, same thing. What does it look like to care for the whole patient? So if I'm working on a medical floor, it's not a psych floor, but I'm taking care of a whole person. So how are they doing mentally and emotionally and spiritually, if they wanna talk about their faith? And if you're not a person of faith and your patient happens to ask if you'll pray for them. Then if you know Sally down the hall prays, go get Sally, so Sally can come pray for your patient. You know, don't just leave them hanging because, well, no, I don't do that. No. So, paying attention to them as a whole person.

I remember years ago, I had this patient. He was an elderly gentleman, we just hit it off. I remember coming to work one day, and they were just talking so poorly about him. I'm thinking, you know, what happened? But when I went in the room, I mean, we just had this rapport.

And I mean, I really cared about him, you know. And for some reason, I mean, he might have gotten on other people's nerves. He might have done things to them he didn't do to me, but that wasn't my story. So I couldn't join in that kind of conversation because I had a good rapport with him. And so just trying to pay attention to how they're doing, what are their questions.

You know, I can remember him just being so appreciative when I would just let him talk about his life, you know, what was going on. And it can be challenging now, especially working in a hospital, because you only got so much time. They give you all these patients, and you're trying. I'm just gonna have to say, I do not miss hospital nursing. Good gracious alive. It's a lot, and I bless every every one of y'all out there still working in the hospital. then educating our patients about not only what is going on with your body as much as possible, but about their mental health. So they have a chronic illness or whatever, you know, to talk to them, you know, how are you handling this? How are you doing mentally, spiritually? You know, like, just checking in with them in that kind of way. And then being aware of and paying attention to your cultural competence, because, you know, everybody's not sensitive to everybody on the planet.

Whether I agree, disagree with your belief system, or whatever, you're still a human being made in God's image, and I wanna try to care for you well. So being aware of that and then ongoing personal development. Like, what are you doing to grow? Are you taking some classes? You know? Is it time for a change? I think some people stay in jobs too long. You know? Look. I'm gonna tell you, I think it's time for you to change up. So being aware. So if you're sensing that, oh, I'm getting kind of worn or burned out here. Is it time to start exploring maybe other avenues where you can work? So those are just a few of the things that I would say.

Yeah. So for somebody who is maybe struggling in their current job and having that question of, is this just a hard thing that I need to push through, or is this something I need to move on from? Do you have any advice about how to discern the distinction?

Yeah. When it starts to affect your performance on the job, when it starts to affect you when you've left the job, I think those are two things right there. Because if you're having a difficult time and for some reason you feel like it's not time to go, then what can you do to make it a healthier place for yourself? If you feel like you cannot do that, then I think you better go. Yeah. Because some of these environments can be so toxic.

Yeah. So that's what I would say. If your performance is being affected and your personal life, then I would encourage you to consider maybe it's time to make a change. And you might not even been there that long.

You know, sometimes it doesn't take that long to find out an environment is toxic. Yeah. Then you don't have to stay there for years to find out that it's not healthy for you. Maybe the other people are thriving and doing okay in it, but you're not. And so, then what do you need to do?

It's interesting. Earlier, you talked about listening to young people, and now I'm hearing you say listen to yourself, listen to the symptoms that are rising up in your own life and paying attention to those things, respecting what your body is telling you.

Yeah. Another story just came to mind. I hadn't been a nurse long. Matter of fact, I think I might have only been a nurse for a year at this time. I was so miserable. I remember my patient had, I think, knee surgery or something. So I was at the foot of her bed taking care of her wound. And the next thing I knew, I was crying. I was so miserable. Oh. And I just remember thinking, okay. I gotta get it together. Oh my gosh. Yeah.

I still remember that. Isn't that something? Yeah. So clearly, it was time for me to make a change.

And I started pursuing it. I did.

I'm glad, and I'm grateful for that permission and encouragement to our listeners if they're in a toxic environment or there's just no way they're going to be able to get a handhold to be healthy themselves. Like, it is okay, and it's good and right to leave those spaces. We don't have to stay forever in a toxic situation.

Yeah. And, you know, and sometimes it may take a while, you know, because if you have responsibilities, you gotta work, you gotta take care of those responsibilities. Well, boy, start doing your homework. Start doing your homework. And even that can encourage you that, like, I am not resigned to stay here for the rest of my life. You know? I I can get out. It may take some time, but devise a plan. Get a plan in place.

Yeah. And what about for those who are called to stay, but it's still not easy per se? I'm just picturing, like, you know, a 20 something, 30 something year old nurse driving in to a shift. They know they've got a hard shift ahead. What do you envision Jesus saying to those nurses who, you know, are called to keep keep it up, keep going?

Yeah. And number one, I appreciate those who stay for the long haul when it's hard because they love their work, and they love people, and they love their work. For those who, you know, believers and nurses who are believers, decided to keep going for the long haul in a tough situation. One of the things that always helped me in those times was remembering that Jesus was with me always, like, for real. And so I relied on him, whether that's talking to him all throughout the night.

At one hospital, they called me the singing nurse because I'd be singing, and would help me in developing friendships. And even if not friendships with a colleague or two, but you have a good working relationship. That can be helpful, knowing that that you're not alone. Number one, spiritually, because Jesus is with you. You know, the Holy Spirit is there to give you wisdom and guidance and strength and power and all of that.

But then also to know that, you know, if it's just one or two others who've got your back, can be so helpful. And then paying attention to your schedule, you know, making sure it's doable for you because people work you to death if you let them. They will slap work you to death. And so you may need to go, no. We change something up here.

And then just paying attention to the self-care that we've already talked about. I think those are some of the things that can help a person if they're led to stay for the long haul.

Yeah. Anything else you wanted to share or say to our listeners today?

Yeah. I wanna say to the nurses out there, you know, because I'm doing nurse education now around mental health with our ministry. I don't have the hands-on anymore. But just to all of you, the hands on, the nurse educators, the, you know, administrators, just all of you, I commend you. I bless you for the work that you're doing.

Please take care of yourself because, know from experience, the better health I'm in, the better care I give me is the better care that I can give someone else. So thank you all for who you are, for what you do, and I bless you in Jesus' name.

Thank you so much, Skip. Well, where can people find you and your resources and work?

Yeah. So, I do have a website, and it captures my university work as well as some of the other work that I do and my resources, and that is at skipmcdonald.com. Pretty simple. Find me and I would love to hear from some of you. I have a contact form on there.

And and, of course, Nurses Christian Fellowship, they know where to find me always. And, so, yeah, I would love to hear from some of you.

Great. Thank you. We appreciate you so much, Skip. Thank you so much for being on today.

Yeah. It's just been a pleasure. Thank you for having me.

So we started this episode asking when is it time to stay and when is it time to leave? So Skip helpfully encouraged us, first of all, not to compare ourselves to others. Just because others are thriving in your same role does not necessarily mean that it's a good fit for you. She shared that when the job is toxic, your performance is suffering, or your personal life is suffering, those are some signals to start exploring other options. And if you are called to stay when it's hard or when it's really particularly taxing, Skip recommends that you have one to two coworkers who really have your back, who can be there for you, that you set boundaries with your scheduling, and that you keep up with your self care.

And most importantly, she reminds us that Jesus is always with us. And if you're having a hard time believing or experiencing that, I would highly, highly encourage you to find a spiritual director who can help you attune to what the Lord is doing in you and around you. And now we're gonna end with one more fun story that Skip remembered just as she and I wrapped up our call.

Yeah. So I just remembered another story. I was a young nurse, pretty young. I was working in labor and delivery, I had a patient and we struck up a rapport.

And I think I had her again the next night and got to just share who I was and you know, my faith. Just like I said, I just talk about my journey with Jesus. Like I said, I ain't trying to beat nobody over the head. None of that. But in the midst of that, I had the privilege of leading her to Jesus.

Oh my goodness. Just right there in in the hospital room. And I want you to know, we stayed in touch, and then we got out of touch. And about this year, a friend of mine's mom was in touch with her, and we got reconnected after all these years. And the way we did, she was telling my friend's mom, I was at the hospital giving birth to my child, and there was this little nurse named Skip who led me to Jesus. Oh my goodness. And my friend's mom was like, I only know one Skip. So she reached out and I got to reconnect with my friend. Oh my goodness. kids are grown, you know, married, children, everything. And when I laid eyes, she still had the Bible I gave her. After all these years.

That is so special. I love that.

Yeah. I'm getting teary just thinking about it. wondered where she was. We just, you know, how you just lose touch with people.

But in God's providence, he wanted us to reconnect.

I love that. That's such an encouragement when we get to hear and see, you know, the fruit of our planting and watering and, you know, what the Lord does in somebody's lives. It's so fun.

Oh my goodness. It's just one of the greatest things on the planet. So thank you for allowing me to share.

Hey. Thanks for joining us for another inspiring episode of Following Jesus in Nursing. We hope you've been encouraged and equipped in integrating your faith with your nursing practice. Be sure to check out our show notes for info about connecting with Nurses Christian Fellowship as well as links and resources mentioned in today's episode. Don't forget to check out NCF membership at ncf-jcn.org and use the coupon code Following for $10 off.

And remember, as you go about your work as a nurse, you are not alone. Jesus is right there with you, guiding your steps and using you to bring healing to those in need. Thanks for listening to Following Jesus in nNrsing, and may your faith continue to be a light in the world of health care.